Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 15

Thread: Two-Ship Medium Altitude Tactics: Wedge/Bombs

  1. #1
    GOMER 2 Noodle's Avatar
    United States
       United States
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,570

    Awards Showcase

    Thanks Thanks Given 
    615
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1,962
    Thanked in
    685 Posts

    Two-Ship Medium Altitude Tactics: Wedge/Bombs

    ALCON:

    In an effort to more effectively engage targets from medium-altitude as a cohesive two-ship element, Baxter and I briefed a combat sortie last night that utilized a variation of a tactic called the Wedge/Bombs attack. As its name implies, the Wedge/Bombs attack is a bomb attack employed from Wedge formation at medium altitude, usually as Shooter/Shooter.

    Shooter/Shooter refers to the format used to describe roles during the fighter-to-fighter brief, and can also be shortened to just "Shooters". 476th members, see your A-10 contract document for additional fighter-to-fighter standards.

    Wedge/Bombs allows the two-ship element to simultaneously attack a target with freefall munitions from separate directions while providing lateral flightpath deconfliction as well as sufficient timing deconfliction to allow the Wingman (WM) to avoid Flight Lead's (FL) weapon frag envelope. The split attack affords the WM better protection from Air Defenses (AD), by allowing him to approach undetected from off-axis.

    For the attack illustrated below, descriptive comms passed during the fighter-to-fighter brief would be "...WEDGE/BOMBS, IN EAST, OFF SOUTH, SORT WEST."





    To execute the attack, begin in Wedge formation. When FL calls "IN", the WM should check-turn at FL's roll-in point. Approaching FL's roll-in point, the WM clears FL's six, deconflicts flightpaths, scans for threats, and maneuvers to his own base position. When the WM observes FL executing his SEM, he rolls in and executes his own attack. After coming off the target, FL arcs the target, clearing the WM's six and scanning for threats. As the WM performs his SEM, FL reverses his turn toward the egress heading and the WM rejoins to Wedge.

    476th members: don't forget to comply with the priorities as prescribed in the appropriate egress contract.

    A variation of this attack can be flown with Suppressor/Shooter roles. In this case, the Suppressor employs the 30mm gun or 2.75" rockets from standoff range in order to suppress the target while the Shooter maneuvers to deliver LDGP or CBU from off-axis. On 476th DS missions, suppression is an effective tactic that will cause the AI to button-up/hunker-down.

    Fighter-to-Fighter comms for the modified attack would be "...WEDGE/GUNS/BOMBS, SUPPRESSOR/SHOOTER, IN EAST, OFF SOUTH, SORT WEST."

    Typical deliveries for the Suppressor include the 30/45 HAS, LRS, and 45 HATR. Typical deliveries for the Shooter include 30/45 DB and 30/45HADB.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Noodle; 06Jan15 at 12:47.

  2. The Following 14 Users Say Thank You to Noodle For This Useful Post:

    Ashy (06Jan15), Dojo (06Jan15), Eddie (06Jan15), El_Roto (06Jan15), Hansolo (12Jan15), Howie (06Jan15), JayPee (06Jan15), KIMB (06Jan15), Neck (06Jan15), PFunk (07Jan15), Ski (07Jan15), Snoopy (06Jan15), Trigger (06Jan15), ZeroMass (10Jan15)

  3. #2
    Member JayPee's Avatar
    Netherlands
       Netherlands
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    490
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    144
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    78
    Thanked in
    60 Posts
    Noodle, interesting read! Back when I was a kid I remember the same sort of drawings depicting Tornado's runway bombing runs in Iraq. The idea is easy to get a grasp on but I think exact timing and headings are paramount. I'll go and see if I can attempt the maneuver with someone.

    You mention the Shooter/Shooter format. Is there an overview of all (or the most used) formats with a description of their purpose, strengths/weaknesses, etc.? Or does that belong to the internal learning material?

  4. #3
    Senior Member PFunk's Avatar
    Canada
       Canada
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    690
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    112
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    388
    Thanked in
    217 Posts
    I'm not sure what the group policy is on relaying information out of internal documents but most of the stuff mentioned herein is standard in real life TTPs. I'm not sure how much is readily available to the pubic but I do know that there's a pretty comprehensive guide to real world F-16 tactics thats available that would include I imagine a great deal of identical language that would presumably be in the equivalent real life A-10 docs that aren't available. I can't from memory state whether the fighter fighter brief and all pertinent terms are mentioned but it would be universal between all USAF attack aircraft I imagine (someone who knows correct me if incorrect).

    As for this attack diagram, this is good shit. It gets me all tingly in the johnnies. This makes me want to do my warface. This is obscene, tactical porn at its finest.
    Last edited by PFunk; 07Jan15 at 23:03.

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to PFunk For This Useful Post:

    JayPee (08Jan15)

  6. #4
    GOMER 2 Noodle's Avatar
    United States
       United States
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,570

    Awards Showcase

    Thanks Thanks Given 
    615
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1,962
    Thanked in
    685 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by JayPee View Post
    Noodle, interesting read! Back when I was a kid I remember the same sort of drawings depicting Tornado's runway bombing runs in Iraq. The idea is easy to get a grasp on but I think exact timing and headings are paramount. I'll go and see if I can attempt the maneuver with someone.
    I've always had a soft spot for the Tonka. I'm not sure what it is, but I love airplanes that have big honkin' flaps, slats, and spoilers...the Tornado, F-111, F-14, the A-6/EA-6B, hell even the 727. The Tornado even has thrust reversers...instant win in my book!

    But about the tactics, I'm not sure how coordinated and choreographed the Tornado attacks are - although I imagine that since they're low-level attacks, frag deconfliction is probably achieved primarily through precise timing - but for the A-10, things are much more fluid. There are no headings to give, because its an entirely visual process that is dependent upon the type of delivery being flown (30DB or 45HARB?), where the wingman was positioned within Wedge formation (forward/inner limit, or aft/outer limit?), and even the winds aloft.

    As such, it's as much art as it is science.

    You mention the Shooter/Shooter format. Is there an overview of all (or the most used) formats with a description of their purpose, strengths/weaknesses, etc.? Or does that belong to the internal learning material?
    We do have detailed descriptions of the roles but you're right, it's an internal thing at the moment. Even though I created that section of "the book", I wouldn't release it without first discussing it with the rest of the group staff. So for now I'll have to defer. Hope you understand.

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to Noodle For This Useful Post:

    JayPee (08Jan15)

  8. #5
    476 vFG Founder Snoopy's Avatar
    United States
       United States
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    9,541

    Awards Showcase

    Thanks Thanks Given 
    5,384
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    4,351
    Thanked in
    2,109 Posts
    I don't see any harm in explaining what the roles are.

  9. #6
    Member JayPee's Avatar
    Netherlands
       Netherlands
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    490
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    144
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    78
    Thanked in
    60 Posts
    PFunk, do you have a link for that specific document?

    Noodle, I think the Tornado (next to the 18C and 15E w/ CFT) is one of the coolest looking jets still around. But then I also love the looks of the UH-60 series...
    Last edited by JayPee; 08Jan15 at 14:05.

  10. #7
    Member ZeroMass's Avatar
    Netherlands
       Netherlands
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    329
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    285
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    203
    Thanked in
    114 Posts
    Hey Noodle, Snooze and I decided to practice the Wedge/Bombs attack yesterday. I think in the end we did pretty good for our first try, but if you don't mind, could you give us some feedback? . Only if you have the time!

    Tacview is attached and video from my view (2) is here: http://www.twitch.tv/zero_mass/b/609344767 (available for two weeks.

  11. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to ZeroMass For This Useful Post:

    Griffin (12Jan15), Spokejocky (12Jan15)

  12. #8
    GOMER 2 Noodle's Avatar
    United States
       United States
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,570

    Awards Showcase

    Thanks Thanks Given 
    615
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1,962
    Thanked in
    685 Posts
    Cool, glad somebody is actually using this. I'd watch right now, but for some reason Twitch doesn't work on my Android, so I'll have to wait until tonight when I can use the desktop.

  13. #9
    Senior Member PFunk's Avatar
    Canada
       Canada
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    690
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    112
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    388
    Thanked in
    217 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by JayPee View Post
    PFunk, do you have a link for that specific document?
    http://fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/docs/16v5.pdf

    That should be the one. Its full of pretty pictures and diagrams and uses lots of terms that you should now be familiar with.

  14. The Following User Says Thank You to PFunk For This Useful Post:

    JayPee (12Jan15)

  15. #10
    Member JayPee's Avatar
    Netherlands
       Netherlands
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    490
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    144
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    78
    Thanked in
    60 Posts
    Seems like a great document, not only for Viper drivers. Thanks!
    Last edited by JayPee; 12Jan15 at 07:53.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  


Like our website?

You can help us by donating to cover our costs.

Many sincere thanks!


Search

Follow us

Twitter Twitter youtube