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Thread: Hi-ILS/LOC DME RWY 32 Vaziani

  1. #11
    Retired Pilot Tex's Avatar
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    A couple of related question for you Snoopy. Is the HUD in the A-10 not certified for IFR? And what about the nav database in the CDU? On my old legacy MC-130, we had no HUD and the nav database was not certified but on our newest MC-130J, the HUD is the primary flight instrument and the nav database is certified. Hell, we don't even compute TOLD anymore, we just plug in a few numbers into the mission computer and read it off.

  2. #12

    KOVIC


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    Snoopy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tex View Post
    Is the HUD in the A-10 not certified for IFR? And what about the nav database in the CDU?
    No sir neither the HUD or CDU is approved for instrument procedures.

  3. #13
    Member Spokejocky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Destroyer View Post
    Agree 100% airports in the CDU are for reference only. It will get your brain twisted when your IMC and stressed out, seeing that reference on the HUD or the CDU. And as for me K.I.S.S. is apparently required lol
    He speeks the truth, if we have a strong crosswind, the TVV will have a pointer to the Real TVV that can't be displayed in the HUD with out bank drft and rudder. For a while I practiced with out HUD as it was a big discraction. One could add a nav aid using OSET, but I'll attest it and the HSI will steer you wrong. The VVI better for the ARC, 1.5 or 2 from bagem will put me just above the 5000ft IAF. I say this as its saved me after I failed to set altitude, I don't fail that much any more. Shouuld be able to ILS with no CDU nor HUD. and by all means do not Divert, keeps out of all sorts of possible goofs.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  4. #14
    Member NARC's Avatar
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    As Snoopy mentioned before, you should be able to fly all the approaches using just the TACAN and/or ILS and the HSI. Just like you would do with a VOR/ILS in a Cessna, well maybe just a bit faster haha. If anyone would like to talk methods for TACAN point-to-point navigation (this enables you to fly direct to a fix such as BAGEM without the use of a CDU WPT, essentially you could fly around the entire map just using the TACAN), shoot me a PM.

    Oh and TEX where'd you fly C130s? I had a buddy from flight school that got assigned to fly them out of Hurlburt field in FL.
    Last edited by NARC; 18Mar15 at 17:07.

    "Pilots take no special joy in walking. Pilots like flying." - Neil Armstrong

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  6. #15
    Member JayPee's Avatar
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    NARC, instead of recieving a number of PMs and replying, could you perhaps spend a few words in a reply/new topic to point to point navigation using the primary instruments?

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    Member NARC's Avatar
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    Yeah I can do that, it probably won't be done until tomorrow at the earliest. I'll need to make some visuals to properly depict what's happening.

    "Pilots take no special joy in walking. Pilots like flying." - Neil Armstrong

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  10. #17
    Member JayPee's Avatar
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    I know the basics that you can derive your own location since you know a heading and a distance, and that you can also aim at an intersection of two heading/distance vectors but I'd very much like to get a run down by somebody with actual experience.

  11. #18
    Member Crom's Avatar
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    Very nice Look forward to it and thanks for the time brother!
    Crom Wills it[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  12. #19
    Retired Pilot Tex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NARC View Post
    Oh and TEX where'd you fly C130s? I had a buddy from flight school that got assigned to fly them out of Hurlburt field in FL.
    Small world, I flew out of Hurlburt from '07-'12. Flew 4 years out of RAF Mildenhall before that hauling Crom's cronies around Europe and other garden spots. When did y'all go through flight school? Did you know if he went gunships? Good chance we crossed paths at some point.

    Back to the topic at hand...if you really want to get into the weeds in navigation, take a read through AFPAM 11-216 (link). It's an oldie but goodie. I think 2001 is still the latest but its been a couple years since I had my flight pubs checked. What NARC is referring to is known as a Fix-to-fix (or what we called the pencil method as you do it by simply holding a pencil up to the BDHI). Here's a quick cut-and-paste from -216 with some of my notes in brackets. It should at least get you started until NARC can do up something better. Or I'd be happy to see if I can get some examples from DCS and Vaziani to show it.

    Fix-to-Fix Navigation (Using RMI and BDHI). Flying from one radial and DME to another is basic to many departures and approaches. A heading to the desired point may be derived quickly through the use of an RMI, providing a radial and a separate readout of DME. The same procedures apply for a BDHI. The following technique and example are provided in order to demonstrate how to compute a heading. Refer to Figure

    OPZUG1p.jpg

    - Tune, identify, and monitor correct VOR and TACAN.
    - Turn the aircraft in the general direction of the desired fix by turning to a heading approximately halfway between the head of the bearing pointer (000 deg) and the radial on which the desired fix is located (090 deg). In this case, turn to 045 deg. [this is to get you generally headed in the right direction]
    - Visualize your aircraft position and the desired fix on the RMI as follows:
    -- The center of the RMI is considered to be the VOR or TACAN, and the compass rose simulates the radials around the station.
    -- The fix with the greater range (180deg/60) is established at the outer edge of the compass card. [ This is point B in red...where you are]
    -- The fix with the lesser range (090deg/30) is established at a point which is proportional to the distance represented by the outer edge of the compass card. [this is point C in red, notice its half way to the edge...30 is half of 60. If we wanted the 090 for 15 DME, it would be one-quarter the way to the edge...this is where you need to go]
    - Determine the heading to the desired fix by connecting your present position to your desired fix with an imaginary line on the RMI [solid yellow line from B to C...where you are to where you want to go]. Establish another imaginary line parallel to the line labeled B to C through the center of the RMI [dashed yellow line]. This line will indicate your no-wind heading to your desired fix (030deg).
    - Turn to 030deg and apply any drift correction. With 5deg right drift, we would turn to 025deg.
    - Cross-check your position continually and correct as necessary.

    Edit: I realized it may not have been obvious as to why we call it a pencil method...In place of the yellow line, imagine holding up a pencil instead while flying...hence the name.
    Last edited by Tex; 19Mar15 at 03:15.

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  14. #20
    Member Crom's Avatar
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    Awesome knowledge ! Ya we are cronies for sure hehehehe. Oh by the way the c130 door jump went great last week. Pilots where smooth as butter flying. Forget the dam tail number though..
    Crom Wills it[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

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